Posted by
HvySlpr on Friday, August 01, 2008 4:55:23 PM
H: One of the possible consequences of having sex is pregnancy, planned or otherwise. If this risk is too great, do not indulge in the act. It really is that simple. Children under "legal age" are punished all the time; they go to jail, get detention, etc. Parents do hold responsibility, but not sole responsibility.
"..who then is responsible for unwanted children?"
This is going to sound crazy: the parents. They don't like it, so sad, stop having sex with people you don't know. Making abortion legal did not stop unwanted children from being born. If the state is deemed responsible, like in communist states (they work real well - no poverty - especially in children), every time someone has a kid they would have otherwise aborted, doesn't the state have a financial obligation to limit procreation? Maybe they should sterilize people too. This all sounds vaguely familiar. Oh yeah…the Nazis did that. The difference; the Nazis killed far fewer people.
J: You made me laugh! But my point is, you want the child born, so why don't you care for the child? Since you have such input on what the women should do with her body and care so much for the life of an unborn child, why not have some input in rearing the child, supporting the child, feeding and caring for the child, donate some child support, pick him and go to the playground, change the diapers. [HvySlpr], you're not going to budge on this one and neither am I. Can we agree to move on?
H: Never, loser. Again, abortion is not an economic policy debate. It is a matter of life and death. The abolitionist, women’s suffrage, and civil rights movement combined.
You can use this same argument for taking care of our wives:
"I haven't killed my wife, but only because it's illegal! So why doesn't the government, who is obviously stepping all over my freedom of choice, take care of her from now on?!"
You want a nanny state? Good luck. Learn from history, it is unsustainable. The more power you give the government the less you have. We need them for national defense, rule of law, and to uphold contracts, period.
Say “Uncle.”
J: NEVER! I want you to say “freedom of choice,” and “women's rights.” Abortion is not an economic policy, but of personal choice. It is not fun, happy time. But we live with the choice we make, good or bad. You just keep defending unborn children, and I'll support women's rights. THE END!
END MAY 12, 2008
BEGIN MAY 13, 2008
H: You do have freedom of choice, unless it affects someone else's freedom(s), i.e. the right to life. “Women's rights?” Rights, under the law and God, are not gender specific. I refuse to grant women any more or any fewer rights, based solely on gender. That's called sexism, and I don't subscribe to it. I will concede that you cannot take away someone's free will and freedom to choose if you concede these irrefutable facts, delaying the inevitable tongue lashing you deserve:
1. Your freedom to choose is protected as long as it doesn't infringe on other's rights.
2. The freedom of choice is not without consequence, legal, moral, or otherwise.
3. Life can begin nowhere else but conception, legally and scientifically, as we now define life and conception.
LIFE:
Conventional definition: Often scientists say that life is a characteristic of organisms that exhibit the following phenomena:
- Homeostasis: Regulation of the internal environment to maintain a constant state; for example, sweating to reduce temperature.
- Organization: Being composed of one or more cells, which are the basic units of life.
- Metabolism: Consumption of energy by converting nonliving material into cellular components (anabolism) and decomposing organic matter (catabolism). Living things require energy to maintain internal organization (homeostasis) and to produce the other phenomena associated with life.
- Growth: Maintenance of a higher rate of synthesis than catalysis. A growing organism increases in size in all of its parts, rather than simply accumulating matter. The particular species begins to multiply and expand as the evolution continues to flourish.
- Adaptation: The ability to change over a period of time in response to the environment. This ability is fundamental to the process of evolution and is determined by the organism's heredity as well as the composition of metabolized substances, and external factors present.
- Response to stimuli: A response can take many forms, from the contraction of a unicellular organism when touched to complex reactions involving all the senses of higher animals. A response is often expressed by motion, for example, the leaves of a plant turning toward the sun or an animal chasing its prey.
- Reproduction: The ability to produce new organisms. Reproduction can be the division of one cell to form two new cells. Usually the term is applied to the production of a new individual (either asexually, from a single parent organism, or sexually, from at least two differing parent organisms), although strictly speaking it also describes the production of new cells in the process of growth.
CONCEPTION:
We have reached a point where my logic is infallible and irrefutable. Any denial of the above conditions directly contradicts your previous statements. Nothing further may be said by you except the following:
"[HvySlpr], lord of debate and all that is political, I concede the three above points, realize the fallibility and illogical nature of my arguments and humbly request your pardon. Teach me the way."
To which I will respond:
"[J], you have always been a friend an confidant. Liberalism, a disease from which you suffer, has crept into the inner-most portions of your brain and has obviously affected your thought process. Of course, you are forgiven, but now, as penance for your sins (liberalism, doubt, and illogical arguments), spread the word of this and other conservative principles. I do this as a friend, and as a political physician, prescribing conservatism, the only known cure from the aliment by which you suffer (liberalism). Tell no close friends of this epiphany, as the opposition to such thoughts reign supreme, without mercy, in the towns, churches, work-places, and neighborhoods we inhabit. You are amongst enemies in Chicago, Cook County, and Illinois, but you are not without friends. Take heed and God speed in your quest.
J: Ha! I'm glad you've had this conversation in your head. I will concede to the definition of life, but will always hold to choice and free will, with its consequences. Great debate! Let's do it again sometime.